TOPIC: Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT

Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 10 months ago #993

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Mercedes 190E , 3.0-24v engine swap, t66 turbo, megasquirt EFI, 6x630cc/min injectors, boost ~ 0.9 bar


Last Edit: 3 years 10 months ago by Dropout.
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 10 months ago #1000

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Impressive power figure! Does the map is finished ? Where does the car has been mapped ? Road or chassis dyno ? Any explanation about why the power drop immediately after the peak ?

I did some megasquirt II installs a few years ago, this is a very good and accurate standalone ECU !
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 10 months ago #1003

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Thanks ! This is a street/road tune and I can say that the map is 99% complete . I think the drop in power is due to the factory camshafts and intake manifold. I'll soon be changing to a smaller turbocharger since this one is a bit laggy and I want to have a larger power band, if I estimated correctly, I'll have the same peak power but full boost will be around 500-600 rpm earlier. Megasquirt is a nice ECU, easy to tune and is very good for it's price .
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 10 months ago #1006

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The 3.0L engine comes from which car ? What turbo is fitted at the moment ?
Yes a smaller turbo would be better for the powerband.
Do you use knock sensor (or other way to detect knock) to map the ignition as it's a turbo engine ? What MS is it ? MS2 ? DIYPNP ?
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 10 months ago #1011

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The engine is from a mercedes 300ce-24v, the turbo is a ebay t66 turbo. I used detcans for listening for knock while mapping the ignition advance but since I don't use a knock sensor the ignition is tuned to be on the safe side. I use and old version of Megasquirt (v2.2 board) with MSII processor.

Here is a picture of the car

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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 7 months ago #1118

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Swapped to the smaller turbo and did a few measurments, here are the results :





and comparison with old t66 and new turbo

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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1119

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Hi Dropout,
Very interesting to see this comparison! And a little bit surprised to see that the small turbo produce as much peak power as the bigger one. This is certainly a amazing car to drive.
Which tool did you use to make the comparison ? Excel ?

I have published a beta of the next PerfExpert release (1.6.0) : are you interested in becoming beta tester ? This version allows you to publish results on the web, as on the iOS version. There is also an alpha version (1.7.0) that allow comparison (only web comparison), but not published yet.
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1134

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Hi DanGTZ, thanks, the car is very nice to drive. The hp/nm curve is exactly as I expected since from tests and analysis I came to the conclusion that the limiting factor was not the smaller turbo. Actually now the car is a lot faster since it has a larger power band .

For the comparison I used OpenOffice (similar to Excel), it's very easy to do, just export the runs as data and then import them in Openoffice/Excel .

DanGTZ, thank you for the offer, I'm very interested in becoming a tester for the app .
Last Edit: 3 years 6 months ago by Dropout.
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1137

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To become beta tester, you will have to join the PerfExpert Beta G+ community. All is explained here : www.perfexpert-app.com/fr/forum/announce...eta-tester.html#1136
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1138

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Can I write a little blog article about your turbo comparison to show how you can use PerfExpert for such a case ?
If you are OK, can you give me more info please ?
If possible : small turbo name (or hybrid mods), boost pressure, engine name or engine code (or simply the car the engine come from). Is there other mods when you switch to the smaller turbo ? Which fuel used ?
Thanks
Last Edit: 3 years 6 months ago by DanGTZ.
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1139

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Thanks, I'll join the G+ community and start testing the beta version.

DanGTZ, of course you can write a blog :).

The engine is m104 980 3.0-24v from a 300ce 24v, compression ratio is lowered from 10.1:1 to 9.2:1 with a thicker head gasket. For
fuel and ignition I use megasquirt v2.2 with MS2 dаughter board/ MS2 processor and 6x630cc/min siemens-deka injectors. The smaller turbo is a hybrid turbo build using holset turbine/compressor wheels and garret housings (exhaust a/r .82), the larger turbo is T66 with exhaust a/r 1.15. Boost pressures is 0.9 bar, there are no other modifications between the turbo swaps. I'm using 98/100 octane (EURO) gasoline, the car is only street tuned .


Here are some pictures (if you need some for the blog) :

Hybrid setup



T66 setup, not too different



and two recent pictures of the car



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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1187

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The hybrid turbo failed, so I reinstalled the t66 but with a smaller turbine AR (0.82), the result is very good, the car is faster and has more hp/nm at the same boost level. Here is the comparison graph with the new graph added (t6682 - green lines).

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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 6 months ago #1188

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Great results with the new turbo setup! Definitely the one to keep!
Spool as soon as the first hybrid turbo but with more power once boost established. Still 0.9bar ?
Will be able to hit the symbolic 500hp mark with a bit more than 1bar.
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Mercedes 190E 3.0-24vT 3 years 5 months ago #1221

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Thanks, yes the boost is still 0.9 bar. When I have some free time I'll rise the boost to ~1.3-1.4 bar and hopefully hit 500+ hp .
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